Voting at ICU AGM

Irish Kayaking and Canoeing discussion forum.

Moderators: Seanie, EoinH

annie
Posts: 59
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2007 10:02 pm
Location: Galway

Voting at ICU AGM

Post by annie » Thu Sep 25, 2008 11:46 am

Tiernan I split this because the other thread is for discussing the IWW recommendations.

No, one (surely) does not have to be a competitive member to vote.
ICU Letter wrote:Clubs registered with the ICU within the 12 months preceding the date of the AGM are eligible to attend and vote, at that AGM. Clubs should try to ensure that at least one club representative, eligible to vote, attends the Oct 18th meeting.
I presume "eligible" means over 21.

Also
ICU Letter wrote:Individual members registered with the ICU within the 12 months preceding the date of the AGM are eligible to attend and vote, as part of a voting bloc, at that AGM
In addition,

Article 19 (iv) A motion may be put forward by any 2 members provides (i) it deals with a single subject (ii) it is notified to the Secretary in writing not less than 21 days before the Annual Delegate Meeting (iii) it is approved by the Board or an Affiliated Club and (iv) it is duly countersigned by the Chairman of the Board or the Affiliated Club which approved the motion.


If any of this is incorrect please clarify it, thank you.

Nails
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 9:54 pm

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by Nails » Thu Sep 25, 2008 2:32 pm

Im confused! Im 19, can I attend the ICU AGM? Can I vote?

Adrians
Posts: 212
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:22 pm

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by Adrians » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:24 pm

Yes and yes,(if 21+) as part of a voting block if you are req as an indivual member.

The club (ULKC in your case) Will also have a vote.
Last edited by Adrians on Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Seanie
Posts: 840
Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2007 4:27 pm

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by Seanie » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:27 pm

The delegate that casts the vote on behalf of your club or voting block will however have to be over 21.

tiernan
Posts: 139
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 6:37 pm

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by tiernan » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:59 pm

Adrians wrote:Yes and yes,(if 21+) as part of a voting block if you are req as an indivual member.

The club (ULKC in your case) Will also have a vote.

hang on there a sec adrian, be more specific. you answered "yes and Yes (if 21+)"

so in the case of nail's question is that yes (can i attend at the age of 19) and no (can i vote at 19).

or what??

also can someone explain this voting bloc crap, and do clubs count as voting blocs or what?

do individual members totally void of club membership get a vote? does one need to be over 21 to vote as an individual?

remember when answering in these topics... assume people dont know anything to avoid confusion.

T

Adrians
Posts: 212
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:22 pm

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by Adrians » Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:52 pm

Tin,

Your right I'll try explain a bit more, just before I do please understand that this is what I believe to be the situation and there fore open to being off the mark and open to correction.

Any person who is a current menber of the ICU can attend and have there voice heard (as in when a motion is put to the floor for discussion) during the AGM.

As regards voting its a wee bit more complex.

Each club has a vote which is cast by the club delegates. This vote is ment to represent the views of the club they are from. The delegate has to be 21 or over.

Individual members (as I am) are treated a bit different, all indivaul members who attend the ICU AGM a grouped together and as an entity are classed as voting bolck entliting the block to vote like a club. So the individual mebers cast a vote between them selves to decide how the "Blocks vote" will be used. To add into all of that only individual members who are 21 or over are entitled to vote within the block.

I hope that clears the point some what. :?:

Ken
Posts: 49
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:49 pm
Location: DCU
Contact:

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by Ken » Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:58 pm

Can anybody be a clubs delegate, or does it have to be their Captain or Secretary? I think I can remember reading that somewhere but cant find it now.

Adrians
Posts: 212
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:22 pm

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by Adrians » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:03 pm

I know that for a club to propose a motion for discussion it has to be given in writing & signed by the clubs Chairperson and Secretary. I would guess that using this as precidence that those two people must be the club delegates and they would represent the views of the club.

That should not stop any other club member attending the meating and voicing there opnion.

tiernan
Posts: 139
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 6:37 pm

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by tiernan » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:00 pm

That system is so wayward and far fetched its ridiculous. I never thought there was a worse way of elective representation than the college electoral vote, but here it is right in our very own ICU. What ever happened to one man (or woman), one vote. Its good enough for every political decision in this country isn't it?

So if i have gotten it right, each club has the choice to decide at what age people in their club vote right? Its just that the club has to be represented at the AGM by someone over 21. ye?? Thats fine.

As for these "voting blocks" (which is total madness). This seems like a college electoral system, like in the USA where each state has x number of votes and a candidate wins either All or None of these based on majority rules within the state (or block as it were). There fore (if i have this right) your minority vote within your block counts for NOTHING. This is widely known as an undemocratic method of voting.

And in these blocks you have to be over 21 to cast a local vote, and over 21 (naturally) to vote on behalf of your block on AGM issues??

My god the ICU is a mess!

J.K.
Posts: 93
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:53 am

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by J.K. » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:02 pm

Fuck yeah it is. I've never heard of a system that inherently discourages participation and change as much as this does.

canned
Posts: 83
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2007 10:37 am

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by canned » Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:09 pm

Is it stating the obvious to suggest that you can always submit a motion to change it?

canned
Posts: 83
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2007 10:37 am

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by canned » Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:09 pm

Is it stating the obvious to suggest that you can always submit a motion to change it?

Adrians
Posts: 212
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:22 pm

Re: Voting at ICU AGM

Post by Adrians » Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:52 pm

canned wrote:Is it stating the obvious to suggest that you can always submit a motion to change it?
Tony is right,

Sadly to submit an motion as an indivual member is not overly straight forward.
ICU officialy wrote:Motions for consideration at the AGM can only be submitted by clubs registered with
the Union within the 12 months preceeding the date of an annual general meeting.
Motions for consideration at the October 18th meeting must be submitted in writing,
signed by a club's chairperson and secretary, and received at the Canoe Union
Office no later than September 29th, 2008.
I am going to take a guess and say that if an indivual member would like to put a motion for discussion/change that it would have to be seconded in wrighting by at least one other indivual member. I am only grasping at straws with that one, but I am going to contact Micheal Scanlon for the offiicial ICU position.

Just going back to what I said earlier about voting, who can/can't and how it works.
Adrians wrote: Your right I'll try explain a bit more, just before I do please understand that this is what I believe to be the situation and there fore open to being off the mark and open to correction.

I have come across a wee bit more information on this from someone a bit more in the know,

Basically each registered club has one vote plus 1 vote per ten registered member up to a maximum of 12 votes per club. Each club must nominate its voting delegate at the AGM

As regards individual members ; i.e non club members ; they can form a block of ten and that block is entitled to one vote. This is consistent with Club voting a
llowances.


To my knowlege there is no cap on the amount of "blocks" that can be formed.

So folks its all well and good making suggestions and stuff on online forums but if you want to be heard get your arse to the AGM and be heard.

You cannot "bitch and moan" of how rubish you think things are unless you are willing to be pro-active and getting involved. Like it our not if you would like change ( regardless of what way you see things ) make sure your membership is valid and go to the AGM.

or to quote Tony on (AKA Canned) on irishfreestyle
Tony / Canned wrote:That said, I think it's definitely time to approach the situation in a more level headed way than ICU bashing. I'm not trying to be rude but if people want to continue to bash, then they should either get their membership up to date and express a reasonable point in the right environment or accept that the organisation has nothing to offer them and leave the frustration behind.



It's easy to be cynical; perhaps naive to be hopeful, but surely this document and what is obviously a massive amount of time put into it is an opportunity to draw a line in the sand and state what you want your organisation to be?
Regards
Adrian

Post Reply